Hard Charger

[nestos]

All of that being said, the song likely had to have existed in some form by 1995-96 if "Hard Charger" was the working title for GGU...at least, you'd think. Kind of hope that's not the case and that they wrote it in 1997...because not including that song on GGU is inexplicable to me. Not knocking GGU, but I think Hard Charger is better than anything on that album.

Nothing is better than anything on that album

[astro]

I can't see that Hard Charger was played at all other than on the Letterman Show and the Howard Stern PP Premier. Why? Hard Charger is one of the greatest, probably the best song PFP ever recorded. Then they keep touring that year (1997) and don't play it. I don't get it.

The thing is they only play it when Flea and Dave are in tow, for whatever reason. (Perry is obviously not above playing bastardized versions of his songs, so not sure why this song stays behind glass.) I think the only non-televised performance of "Hard Charger" was February 28, 1997 Roseland Ballroom, NYC, while Flea and Dave were still in town from Letterman and the Stern thing. By the performance the next day in DC, Dave had left, and so no Hard Charger in the set (or ever again up to this point). The rest of the '97 gigs were mostly stripped down with no bassist, then the big Relapse news broke, with JA easily stealing the spotlight and knocking P4P into the shadows. All adds up to arguably their best song being forgotten about.

Good point there, I had forgotten they played without Watt or someone on bass during that period.

[clickie]

If they would have titled that album hard charger it would be misleading.

[almerin]

Taken Hard Charger out of the live rotation is like taken Mt Song or Jane Says out of Jane's Addiction live rotation. Another one Cursed Male taken out of rotation. Cursed Male has everything slapped bass, tribal drums, 100% Porno for Pyros punk-funk explosions Nothing else like it. Cursed Male bring it back and more than 3 shows this year please. You guys make us wait 25 years for Porno and can only do 3-4 shows. What the fuck? I'm still waiting for Hard Charger the album. Whens that gonna be 25 more years.

[clickie]

Maybe Perry was such a huge admirer of Howard he decided hey we're gonna give you this exclusive song.

[almerin]

Would want to hear from the band members about history the song, when it was written, who wrote the different guitar parts and how long it took to record it and why it wasn't on GGU. I think if they had it on an album P4P or GGU it would be heard live now.

[Stickyfingers]

Would want to hear from the band members about history the song, when it was written, who wrote the different guitar parts and how long it took to record it and why it wasn't on GGU.

good luck trying to figure out who wrote what, you will need it.

some of the pornos songs were already janes jams, so how can Bad Shit on the first P4P give credit to Pete and Martyn as songwriting.

Martyn write on twitter that he have never listened to good gods urge, he make compliments to Watt, Flea and David J., but most GGU basslines are his work.

The usual mess, as usual.
Plus a lot of drugs and band fights/splits at the time, the band always has foggy memories.

[trevor ayer]

I really like the woodstock and crystal studios soundboards because they have all the martyn versions of the ggu songs and it is a fun take on all of it ... bad shit was perrys riff and he prolly gave band writing credit cuz thats how they did credits in janes .. i don't think dave came up w the riff so perry could divy it up any way he chose ..

[Stickyfingers]

.. i don't think dave came up w the riff so perry could divy it up any way he chose ..

Songwriting credits for Janes & Pornos works like this: the lineup that can get alone together to bring the songs into the studio and record the album, got the credits.

Perry, Eric , Matt Chaikin and Ed Dobrydnio were playing Kettle Whistle since 1985.
In 1997 Perry, Dave, Steve and Flea they go record in the studio, you buy the CD you find Kettle Whistle is a song written by Perry, Dave, Steve and Flea.

Janes/Porno are basically one big dysfunctional extended family,
today they love each other, tomorrow they hate each other and broke, you never know what is going to happen the next day and they did a lots of drugs and who can remember who wrote what.

You can see Dave and Stephen in the front row dancing the basic Janes catalogue in 1986, couple of years later record NS and they got credit of songwriting and ask 25% of the split.
Matt Chaikin and Ed Dobrydnio, canceled.


Hard charger? easy. It was played by Perry Stephen Dave Flea and Pete,so they are the songwriters.
But if a different line up goes into the studio, let's say with Martyn on bass, then Martyn will be co author of Hard Charger songwriting credits.

easy logic

[phenobarb_bambalam]

Cursed Male bring it back and more than 3 shows this year please. You guys make us wait 25 years for Porno and can only do 3-4 shows. What the fuck? I'm still waiting for Hard Charger the album. Whens that gonna be 25 more years.

It's been interesting to read between the (non-existent) lines of social media on this. Pete has been blasting images from the LA show non-stop in the week since. The Perry/PFP accounts, similar. Perk's - effusive, even if not as voluminous. Martyn....crickets. Not making more of it than simple observations, and just hoping that he's just taking stock.

(read: Just hoping this doesn't follow previous scenarios where the wheel has fallen off before take off and then they prop it up with some chaney-shaped joke)

[dannyboy]

So envious of you! Wish I could have seen that show! Sooooo much! Pete crowd surfing !

PB I sent you a message on FB! Do you still use it?

[trevor ayer]

yeah flea getting writing credit on kettle on the cabinet box set was so many kinds of wrong .. any vids of kind heavings set floating around yet? .. kinda wanna watch for the train wreck and lack of crowd response .. at least cheney was not in pfp set .. that's something .. pfp could easily throw together a hardcharger album of b sides singles rando soundtrack tunes plus a couple newly recorded songs ..

[Hokahey]

Cursed Male bring it back and more than 3 shows this year please. You guys make us wait 25 years for Porno and can only do 3-4 shows. What the fuck? I'm still waiting for Hard Charger the album. Whens that gonna be 25 more years.

It's been interesting to read between the (non-existent) lines of social media on this. Pete has been blasting images from the LA show non-stop in the week since. The Perry/PFP accounts, similar. Perk's - effusive, even if not as voluminous. Martyn....crickets. Not making more of it than simple observations, and just hoping that he's just taking stock.

(read: Just hoping this doesn't follow previous scenarios where the wheel has fallen off before take off and then they prop it up with some chaney-shaped joke)

Martyn said from the beginning he was signed for 3 shows.

[someguy]

pfp could easily throw together a hardcharger album of b sides singles rando soundtrack tunes plus a couple newly recorded songs ..

They could easily do a 10 song album and throw in old ones like aqua and little me. There is no reason why they can’t do it.

Btw there’s a video for aqua out there- it sounds great

https://youtu.be/f8y7aBDkRxk

[almerin]

Got my hands onto something I could not touch..

[kv]

Maybe Perry was such a huge admirer of Howard he decided hey we're gonna give you this exclusive song.

I honestly wonder if they maybe had to sign rights over for that song or something of the like? Could just be the live versions with flea were so special they didn't want to taint it? Naw these guys will taint it all...

[Pandemonium]

I honestly wonder if they maybe had to sign rights over for that song or something of the like? Could just be the live versions with flea were so special they didn't want to taint it? Naw these guys will taint it all...

Possibly. I do know that Stern and Co dearly wanted Van Halen to record a new song with Roth (and this was around the VH with Roth reunion MTV appearance disaster) exclusively for the soundtrack but VH wanted something like a $ million plus for one song. Instead, Stern wound up licensing old VH classic Jamie's Cryin'" for the soundtrack for a fraction of the cost. Being follow labelmates on Warner Bros (who released the Private Parts soundtrack), someone probably suggested or passed on the idea of Porno/Janes contributing a new song and a much more budget-friendly price.

[crater]

I honestly wonder if they maybe had to sign rights over for that song or something of the like? Could just be the live versions with flea were so special they didn't want to taint it? Naw these guys will taint it all...

Possibly. I do know that Stern and Co dearly wanted Van Halen to record a new song with Roth (and this was around the VH with Roth reunion MTV appearance disaster) exclusively for the soundtrack but VH wanted something like a $ million plus for one song.

Tool was also supposed to have their cover of No Quarter on the soundtrack but the band yanked it at the last possible moment because while the label Tool was on said it was ok to use the song, when the band heard about it being used they said they didn't want it on there. That caused Howard to go on multiple rants against the band and Maynard personally.

I remember reading an interview years ago that Maynard gave that brought it up and he said one time he was listening to the show and Howard was saying that Maynard was down in the lobby wanting to come up to apologize to Howard but Howard didn't want him in the studio and to have someone throw him out of the building while at the time Maynard was listening to it he was at his house in California

[Hokahey]

I honestly wonder if they maybe had to sign rights over for that song or something of the like? Could just be the live versions with flea were so special they didn't want to taint it? Naw these guys will taint it all...

Possibly. I do know that Stern and Co dearly wanted Van Halen to record a new song with Roth (and this was around the VH with Roth reunion MTV appearance disaster) exclusively for the soundtrack but VH wanted something like a $ million plus for one song.

Tool was also supposed to have their cover of No Quarter on the soundtrack but the band yanked it at the last possible moment because while the label Tool was on said it was ok to use the song, when the band heard about it being used they said they didn't want it on there. That caused Howard to go on multiple rants against the band and Maynard personally.

I remember reading an interview years ago that Maynard gave that brought it up and he said one time he was listening to the show and Howard was saying that Maynard was down in the lobby wanting to come up to apologize to Howard but Howard didn't want him in the studio and to have someone throw him out of the building while at the time Maynard was listening to it he was at his house in California

Shocker. No one from Tool has ever struck me as humble or gracious.

[creep]

Cursed Male bring it back and more than 3 shows this year please. You guys make us wait 25 years for Porno and can only do 3-4 shows. What the fuck? I'm still waiting for Hard Charger the album. Whens that gonna be 25 more years.

It's been interesting to read between the (non-existent) lines of social media on this. Pete has been blasting images from the LA show non-stop in the week since. The Perry/PFP accounts, similar. Perk's - effusive, even if not as voluminous. Martyn....crickets. Not making more of it than simple observations, and just hoping that he's just taking stock.

(read: Just hoping this doesn't follow previous scenarios where the wheel has fallen off before take off and then they prop it up with some chaney-shaped joke)

[SR]

I honestly wonder if they maybe had to sign rights over for that song or something of the like? Could just be the live versions with flea were so special they didn't want to taint it? Naw these guys will taint it all...

Possibly. I do know that Stern and Co dearly wanted Van Halen to record a new song with Roth (and this was around the VH with Roth reunion MTV appearance disaster) exclusively for the soundtrack but VH wanted something like a $ million plus for one song.

Tool was also supposed to have their cover of No Quarter on the soundtrack but the band yanked it at the last possible moment because while the label Tool was on said it was ok to use the song, when the band heard about it being used they said they didn't want it on there. That caused Howard to go on multiple rants against the band and Maynard personally.

I remember reading an interview years ago that Maynard gave that brought it up and he said one time he was listening to the show and Howard was saying that Maynard was down in the lobby wanting to come up to apologize to Howard but Howard didn't want him in the studio and to have someone throw him out of the building while at the time Maynard was listening to it he was at his house in California

Shocker. No one from Tool has ever struck me as humble or gracious.

What do you mean? Is it because it was a last minute pull? I don't know much about the individuals except Maynard's wine is objectively undrinkable, but I lean towards articles/info on great drummers and Danny seems really down to earth in a Kansas sort of way.

[Hokahey]

I honestly wonder if they maybe had to sign rights over for that song or something of the like? Could just be the live versions with flea were so special they didn't want to taint it? Naw these guys will taint it all...

Possibly. I do know that Stern and Co dearly wanted Van Halen to record a new song with Roth (and this was around the VH with Roth reunion MTV appearance disaster) exclusively for the soundtrack but VH wanted something like a $ million plus for one song.

Tool was also supposed to have their cover of No Quarter on the soundtrack but the band yanked it at the last possible moment because while the label Tool was on said it was ok to use the song, when the band heard about it being used they said they didn't want it on there. That caused Howard to go on multiple rants against the band and Maynard personally.

I remember reading an interview years ago that Maynard gave that brought it up and he said one time he was listening to the show and Howard was saying that Maynard was down in the lobby wanting to come up to apologize to Howard but Howard didn't want him in the studio and to have someone throw him out of the building while at the time Maynard was listening to it he was at his house in California

Shocker. No one from Tool has ever struck me as humble or gracious.

What do you mean? Is it because it was a last minute pull? I don't know much about the individuals except Maynard's wine is objectively undrinkable, but I lean towards articles/info on great drummers and Danny seems really down to earth in a Kansas sort of way.

Well, as far as Danny goes...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertai ... 921909002/

Police alleged that Carey used an anti-gay slur and repeatedly jabbed someone in the chest with two fingers.

This made me lose a lot of respect for him. And his and the bands refusal to ever comment or apologize made me lose even more.

[SR]

Yeah, I did see that and never heard about its resolution. I thought I heard that he denied it along with some witnesses. But if true, well then

[Mescal]

I honestly wonder if they maybe had to sign rights over for that song or something of the like? Could just be the live versions with flea were so special they didn't want to taint it? Naw these guys will taint it all...

Possibly. I do know that Stern and Co dearly wanted Van Halen to record a new song with Roth (and this was around the VH with Roth reunion MTV appearance disaster) exclusively for the soundtrack but VH wanted something like a $ million plus for one song.

Tool was also supposed to have their cover of No Quarter on the soundtrack but the band yanked it at the last possible moment because while the label Tool was on said it was ok to use the song, when the band heard about it being used they said they didn't want it on there. That caused Howard to go on multiple rants against the band and Maynard personally.

I remember reading an interview years ago that Maynard gave that brought it up and he said one time he was listening to the show and Howard was saying that Maynard was down in the lobby wanting to come up to apologize to Howard but Howard didn't want him in the studio and to have someone throw him out of the building while at the time Maynard was listening to it he was at his house in California

Shocker. No one from Tool has ever struck me as humble or gracious.

What do you mean? Is it because it was a last minute pull? I don't know much about the individuals except Maynard's wine is objectively undrinkable, but I lean towards articles/info on great drummers and Danny seems really down to earth in a Kansas sort of way.

Well, as far as Danny goes...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertai ... 921909002/

Police alleged that Carey used an anti-gay slur and repeatedly jabbed someone in the chest with two fingers.

This made me lose a lot of respect for him. And his and the bands refusal to ever comment or apologize made me lose even more.

That's a pretty vague news report.

Pretty strange you form an opinion on somebody based on one news report. Maybe he was being harrassed by a fan, maybe he was having a bad day, whatever ...

Shocker. No one from Tool has ever struck me as humble or gracious.

At least they didn't make a movie about how great they are

[Hokahey]

Possibly. I do know that Stern and Co dearly wanted Van Halen to record a new song with Roth (and this was around the VH with Roth reunion MTV appearance disaster) exclusively for the soundtrack but VH wanted something like a $ million plus for one song.

Tool was also supposed to have their cover of No Quarter on the soundtrack but the band yanked it at the last possible moment because while the label Tool was on said it was ok to use the song, when the band heard about it being used they said they didn't want it on there. That caused Howard to go on multiple rants against the band and Maynard personally.

I remember reading an interview years ago that Maynard gave that brought it up and he said one time he was listening to the show and Howard was saying that Maynard was down in the lobby wanting to come up to apologize to Howard but Howard didn't want him in the studio and to have someone throw him out of the building while at the time Maynard was listening to it he was at his house in California

Shocker. No one from Tool has ever struck me as humble or gracious.

What do you mean? Is it because it was a last minute pull? I don't know much about the individuals except Maynard's wine is objectively undrinkable, but I lean towards articles/info on great drummers and Danny seems really down to earth in a Kansas sort of way.

Well, as far as Danny goes...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertai ... 921909002/

Police alleged that Carey used an anti-gay slur and repeatedly jabbed someone in the chest with two fingers.

This made me lose a lot of respect for him. And his and the bands refusal to ever comment or apologize made me lose even more.

That's a pretty vague news report.

Pretty strange you form an opinion on somebody based on one news report. Maybe he was being harrassed by a fan, maybe he was having a bad day, whatever ...

Shocker. No one from Tool has ever struck me as humble or gracious.

At least they didn't make a movie about how great they are

According to a report, obtained by TMZ, Carey got physical with the other person, shoving them in the chest with two fingers and shouting, "You're a f*****g f****t!" multiple times.

If it didn't happen, he didn't bother denying it.

Also I don't care about him getting physical if it was warranted, or about Howard Stern and whatever he does.

My problem is with Danny using that word and neither he nor the band seeming to give a shit.

On a side note, I remember getting a cease and desist from tools lawyers for listing a VHS concert on eBay like 20 years ago. Like I was some big time bootlegger trying to make a living off of them.

I just think they're probably a bunch of douche bags.